ok i will change it to 1000hp. i forgot they have less range. i think i will change it to 3 kings with regular ap. i dont see y it should be removed if its the right price. i thought u made a map specifically for 1v1, so why would anyone use this one? those seem like pretty good ideas. possibility for RCBG shadow, but i probly wont add to RCBG2011 i didnt know that was possible. maybe i will move area for tamerlane + theo. what???.... there can easily be a point for this. mainly to garrison. maybe ur seeing from the perspective of only 1v1. do u play anything else? in team game if u get ****ty civ, buy archers of eyes and garrison all towers. or now that villi is more common they are good for garrisoning in castles + towers built. also if u have mid and are in a rush, archers work well. there still is and always has been a version like that rated. it is a fun map but almost no one joins. i might make a new one by just removing the towers from RCBG2011. i took them out because there is Nevski now. u can buy whatever amount of ap/hp u want with him, so whats the point of other heroes with certain amounts of ap/hp? ive never seen that before. maybe that was only a gamespy version. ok i can probly help u with it after RCBG2011 is done for now (which BTW I will probly now call RCBG2012)

A lot of negative stigma surrounds 2012 due to the freezing issue so I'd probably just name it 2011 v3. Up to you. I did decide to change genitour to three kings as well awhile back.

Edit:This talk of editing 2011 has renewed my vigor towards finishing my version though and I decided starting tomorrow I'll work on it about 2 hours a day until it's done.

Edit 2: You don't need to redesign the top store to prevent p4 from shooting kings. Just set the triggers up using AOK trigger studio to remove projectiles from the treb. Tested it prior and works easily.

Edit 3:Instead of providing a list of stuff I think you should change in 2011 I'm just going to make a tentative one of everything I plan to change in Shadow.

how about adding Archer eyes instead of beli.....with power up......

if u add archers eyes..(the cheap one) then it snot goonna b a civi war anymore.......

Skirm > No Gen > Gen imo

'It seems like this thread is fairly popular so I'll wait and just critique everyone's opinion at once but I just gotta say quick that adding them back in AND increasing their spawn speed to every 3 secs does not make them worthless. If you're the Chineseagainst another archer civ for instance it's much better to just get archers of the eyes right away (assuming the starting king #s for the Chinese would be changed back to 4 like it was in 2010 from 3 as it is in 2011). This is the best way to go because you can only get a power-up of (1) by garrisoning Cho Ku No so you can garrison quick and get quick robin or above fairly easily.
'

yea umm, about that lol, chinese are one of the best civs with imp and full castles, only a few can take them vs a real experienced player, trust me, we dnt need them lol never have..

I object the idea of remove geni. Cause u can easily rush other with same hero with 30 different in pop. U can't save for more king when ur neighbour took the hero either. Geni is a great idea, let it be. Just fix the prize or add invincible skirm.

You're still wrong Zanchy. You don't even play RCB anymore so it's easy to see how you're not up on the strats. However, that doesn't excuse poor logic. If we assume you're correct in that the Chinese are good in imperial (which you're totally wrong btw at least in respect to RCB Gold 2011...way too many people get a hero quickly in 2011 and I'd go so far as to say all heroes can beat the Cho easily especially since they can get them so fast) you'd still need to get to the point of attaining imperial + kings for full castle. Chinese are only good at killing the pyramid/razing in general. They absolutely suck against Robin, Subo, Martel, and even Charlemagne if it's in the right hands...there's a reason they currently get the most kings out of all of the archer civs; they suck. One of the best and hilarious things you can do with Chinese is to rush into someone's base with 200 Cho w/ or w/o genitour in certain instances (i.e. when you know their base is relatively empty) and easily take out their pyramid; it's pretty damn funny. However, that gets you nowhere other than killing them and won't help you win. Cho are pretty damn worthless in 2011. In 2010 they were good against henry and charlemagne if you hit and ran but in 2011 people get heroes too quickly for them to be good. Don't get any ideas if you play me in ffa RCB though. If you hit and run on me and I'm either aztec or jap charlemagne I'll just walk into your base and kill you with your pathetic Cho.

In the example I gave above it's easy to see how getting archers of the eyes with a spawn speed of three secs against another archer civ would be this best choice since like I said Chinese towers only power-up (1) while say brits could get the 9 archers of the eyes at the beginning followed by just creating archers from range and castles (only the starting 2 ... there wouldn't be any need to buy more against chinese) and they could easily win at the cross and start garrisoning units in mid towers for instant robin. Then you'd have pathetic Cho against brits robin... good luck.

Archers of the eyes are great in general for the Chinese in general because if you get them you're pretty much guaranteed to get 20 razes, feed off other civs trying to go quick martel, robin, etc., and you can garrison them in the castles if someone tries to kill you; they do great the castles. In the few games that I've played in 2012 I've easily gone from buying archers of the eyes straight to subo or above. If anything it's too good of a strat and I should probably leave their starting king number at three kings.

In short you're just silly for thinking they're worthless because they can dominate quite easily.

I think RCB in general is beyond being a true civ war; if you want a civ war you should probably be playing CBA where it's greatly unbalanced. In 2010 the majority of people just bought henry and it was a henry war and in 2011 with the exception of a couple civs most of them can just get a quick hero. Due to those reasons I actually thought about making RCB Gold Shadow have all techs enabled but I'm still undecided about doing so; it certainly would make it more even.

It was either you or someone else that mentioned this before but I think this would be a worthless decision for the most part. Think about how archers of the eyes group up when you tell them to patrol and how slow they shoot. Archers of the eyes are needed more to balance out civ differences. Beli is actually pretty dominant imo so I was actually thinking about reducing the hp upgrade because of that. My best strat with beli is when people are camping just go get tamerlanes from the super store and power them up in mid with a genitour there and just kill their units as they try to kill your tamerlane. Also, in respect to tamerlane at 10 kings with a spawn speed of 4 secs, a larger power-up area, and a bonus of 1 ap/hp every 20/40 secs even when they aren't on mid hill is probably what I'm going to do in RCB Gold Shadow.
Totally agree about archers of the eyes; they def aren't worthless. About Nevski though... it's way too easy to see when people are upgrading him since they typically transfer a mass # of kings at once so this is why I added Joan and also a weak hp/ap upgrade to Nevski every 20 secs so you could potentially buy one early and let it build similar to frankish which no one really buys anymore. I'm delayed heading back since I need to set up a new monitor for someone here at home so I probably won't have a list done until Thursday or Friday.

i dont think thats a good idea. it might make it more even but it would take out a lot of the strategy. I almost always base wat hero i buy, on what techs my civ gets. plus i think having more of a civ war makes it more fun with so many possibilities for how the game starts out. one of the main reasons CBA and RCB are the most popular and bloods are so unpopular is likely because of that. in bloods everyone always starts with all the exact same units which makes it kind of boring.
also i dont think archers of eyes would make it much less of a civ war. ppl probly still wont buy it very often as they didnt in the other versions. but maybe, for this 2011 version it should cost 3 not 2?
really? i was actually thinking of increasing the hp. he doesnt seem very dominant to me.
but shouldnt the rate of # of kings to amount of ap/hp ur hero has still be about the same? so for eg. if joan costs 6, then u should get about the same ap/hp with nevski for 6.

Good point about all techs. I'll leave that alone. I'm not sure about the civ war aspect. If I start thinking about that I know it'll lead to me wanting to increase all buys up top by one king and I don't really want to do that because then there's a chance people won't play it because it's too different.

On Archers of the Eyes. I definitely wouldn't make them three kings unless you gave them a spawn speed of every 2 secs. In the past I did two kings and every 3 secs, which seemed fine. It's not like they're totally dominant.

I go back and forth on whether or not to increase or decrease beli hp frequently. In the past I know I suggested an increase to 125 but in games where people feed it seems like this wouldn't do good to counteract that. Idk. Then yet again when you play people that are good the hp increase would be a good choice.

On the hp upgrade note. I'm probably going to increase all Robin Hood Hp to 130. He gets the shaft when it comes to bombard towers in that he can get taken out with a single shot while other heroes (e.g. charlemagne, subo, etc.) don't.

I'm not sure about the Nevski bit atm. I'll look at it later.

Hey do you remember how to take screenshots of the scenario? I can't get it to work for some reason. I believe I've finalized the new design for each base and I have it completed for players 1 and 2 and I wanted feedback before I finished the others.

Ctrl + F12 takes mapshots. I believe it's possible to change in options though

Thank you sir Basse.

Also, I thought about it and I wouldn't add missionary. It downgrades the genitour. Which is maybe the point but I would do either: a) add missionary and keep genitour at 2 kings or b) don't add it and put genitour at three kings. It's much easier to not add it so I'm going with b in Shadow.

Here's what the base redesign looks like currently: [You must login to view link]

I tend to try to avoid changing regular spawning heros hp/ap. if u upgrade techs after uv spawned a hero with changed hp, the tech wont change for them, only works for new units spawned.

A better option is this: Player 2 vs Player 3 at cross. After ? minutes if p3 still has 3/5 of the towers left then p2 is rewarded one king up top. I think I figured it out before that this would be about 12 mins in. If you go longer another person might get the tower. You can't just kick people from games. Voobly won't allow that and let it be rated. You couldn't do this with the hero monk because it'd involve modding units, which I definitely don't want to deal with. I'm not sure if regular monks have the same armor as hero monks but if they do it could just be a regular monk. If anything I would just increase hero monk hp by a couple hundred and leave it at 1 king. OH!!! I forgot. I'm almost positive all civs don't get the +3 conversion range tech so there's no way you could do this for every civ without modding it.

Snap.

i was just having problems with the game crashing when i was testing the map. it might have been the same thing that was happening to your version of RCBG2012 [MeT]Xx_Weapon_xX,
when it was quitting out. it was crashing sometimes but not others, but always when the timer was @ 2 secs if it did crash. the trigger causing the crashing was one i made of condition; timer=3 secs effect; disable tech= elite skirmisher (which i had to use AOKTS for)
maybe it was a trigger similar to this causing your version to crash?